Another bad idea: "This is not to say that we should cause pain. We should not. There is enough of it in the world without anyone ever having to purposely induce it."
Here we have a blindly reasoned demand for pacifism and passivism. This standard of ethics could easily be exploited by street savages and queergroomers to coerce acquiescence to any and every depredaton. Suppose, for instance, that some angry ghetto rat charges toward you while you're walking along a sidewalk. (Fyi, this is a real example.) Should you steadfastly refuse to spray the ghetto rat's face with an acidic solution just because there is "enough of it [pain]" in the world already.? You may think so if you're a twit, so then comes the pain of being attacked by the g.r., who has no doubt failed to experience adequate deterrence throughout its life. What do you suppose that your pacifism has just made more likely if the g.r. sees you again a week later?
Your pain could have easily been avoided by imposing the painful aversive stimulus upon the g.r.'s eyes and nasal cavity. So doing is likely to prevent you from experiencing pain in the short term. Again, in the short term, the total amt of pain may be about the same whichever option (spray or don't spray) you choose. Over the long term, spraying the worthless savage could reduce total pain because the g.r. will be more like to restrain itself. So here we ought to cause pain, or rather, to transfer expected pain from one being to another. (Just be mindful of an arms escalation, which is why I had a knife and warned the g.r. to run if it didn't want to bleed, too.)
Here is some more foolishness "The extreme excess of pain caused by man’s inhumanity to man must stop, and should be prevented whenever possible."
Pethaps the alleged extreme excess of pain is just what sissies, crybabies, and others deserve until they correct their bad attitudes and refain from bad action.
Ridiculous Assertion: "Further, while there is little to no value in physical pain"
On the contrary, physical pain is so important that a person who cannot feel it or who feels it very little, because of (say) some genetic defect or abuse of pain meds, would ruin its body with injuries. Most of us are conditioned during childhood to be wary of hazards like heights, sharpened edges, bugs with stingers, hot objects, rough pavement, and so on. Painful experiences with one or more of them motivates a bit of risk-reward thinking when confronted with these things. Sure, there's a risk of breaking an arm and scraping a few sq. inches of skin off our knees if we crash while biking. The benefits of riding the bike, however, can be obtained by proceeding with caution when learning how to ride. A child who cannot feel pain, however, will not have experienced falls and scrapes as aversive stimuli from which to learn the right lesson about prudence. This one is like a healthy child who systematically underestimates risks or overestimates benefits, and I think we all understand that this sort of child is likely to experience more injuries and a shorter life than average.
This makes perfect sense to me. I wish I could share it with parents I know who are going through all of this. It's pretty sad the bar is so low that my 82 yr old friend said I must be doing a great job as a mother. At least my daughter still wants to be a girl. sheesh.
The conversation with a disrupter yesterday on this subject brought up the question for me of whether to engage or not with insulting people in this space.
A few of us reading at the time confronted politely, which was to our credit, but whether it is a complete waste of effort is a question on my mind because of the disingenuous nature of those contributions.
With our own children we just hold the ground, but we don't know if 'Anonymous' was just a pure bad actor, a good chance of that.
What does anyone think any other approach to this situation should be?
PS I used to deep dive into Mermaids web chat posing as a 'gender questioning' child to see what kind of advice I got, to shocking results. I took screen shots of lots of it and shared with journalists. It is easy to pose as anyone you like online isn't it.
If one kid is reached by responding to trolling it is probably worth it. If the kids would catch on to the uniformity of trans positions and then use critical thinking to extract themselves it would be great. But we love kids who just think emotionally because they found a group that will pretend to love them. (Until they realize transition was an empty promise and desist)
You describe false kindness, false compassion, false mercy and false love. When kindness, love and compassion cannot be questioned or defined, when they are not held up to a template or a source for comparison, they can be perverted. Love is Love. Kind is Kind. Compassion is Compassion. Choose Kindness. "Kindness is Everything." (Really? That's nonsense!!! But its printed on yard signs in front of nearly every home in some Seattle neighborhoods) Before Kindness was everything; Religion, Culture and Tradition provided us with our templates and definitions. Without any guardrails or patterns to follow we can come up with perversion.
When I asked a gender clinician what the difference between the body dysmorphia experienced by someone with anorexia vs someone with gender dysphoria, she explained that they are very similar but gender dysphoria has a gendered flavor. So basically it’s the same body dysmorphia but for some reason they think the gender version has more validity and deserves affirmation. It is all based on the assumptions that sex is a spectrum, and it is separate from gender and gender identity. So made up nonsense.
A very dangerous cult in that they are forcing everyone else to believe in lies! If you tell the simple truth that no man can be a woman.. what every child knows... you are vilified, canceled, fired from your job! Where else has something like that happened? North Korea, Stalinist Russia, Nazi Germany etc. ..
In 50 years people will write masters and PhD work on how this went from less than 1% of the population to over 5% in less than a decade. The biggest lie is that this is some natural reversion to the mean. It's not.
Absolutely spot on. Thank you for your compassion and clarity amid such a lot of cold confusion and carelessness. You could say the sex-change cultists practice a 'kind' to be cruel approach, the very opposite of what these young people and their parents desperately need, and all to feed the cruel money monster too.
"We have actually made it illegal to be nice to people suffering from gender dysphoria." To my mind this is the biggest problem. It's prevented all the counselors, therapists, psychologists and psychiatrists who could work to help resolve these issues from even considering helping these teens and young adults. There's just too much liability socially and professionally. It's a massive chilling effect.
Please be aware there is a malicious presence on this thread calling themselves 'anonymous.' I have reported but the posts might take time to be deleted.
I actually wish the comments were not deleted. I thought it was educational to see how trans-identifying people see this site and how TRAs interact with parents. How are we going to help our kids if we don't know what the influencers like "anonymous" tell them about us? Also, what he said about how cheap estrogen is... I had no idea and I think it is important to know.
If we allow disrupters freely onto this site then it is worth nothing to us. I am sure that others here can give links to reddit sites and others where the mindset is on display. I used to experience more argument like that on twitter till the 'other side' all signed up to 'terf blockers.' For me, this site is for reasoned conversation and expressing our sorrow in a constructive way.
I have doubts about the veracity of anything that poster said. I could feel the pain in the comments, but the comments could have been metaphorically lifted from the dysphoria bible. So much pain and anger. Any divergent thoughts from the current trans narrative means you're a neo-nazi who likes Catholic priests who rape children. Because really that's a huge number of people.
I will say that one person has made me ponder something we see here. Many posters, and essay authors have described the child assuming a trans identity and disowning the parents. I'm now starting to wonder if that's sort of self-fulfilling prophecy of the parent rejecting the child (which is not what's described by our authors here) Where the kid, decides to preemptively strike in the disowning the trans influencers have convinced them is coming?
I've thought that myself. They groom and train the newcomers. You know they tell them that their families aren't going to accept them, they're transphobic, they'll disown you, etc. So they may just be doing the disowning first.
I think what the parent rejects is the gender identity. Or maybe I should just speak for myself, I don’t subscribe to the ideology, the idea that anyone is born in the wrong body. I don’t believe there is any part of a person called a gender identity that exists separate from their physical reality. I am not religious either. It’s really sort of a quasi religion IMO with gender identity replacing the idea of a soul. I don’t believe feelings are truths other than saying that it is true that you have feelings or a specific feeling. I don’t accept beliefs as facts. I believe I am a boy therefore I am a boy or I believe I am a girl therefor I am a girl. My rejection of the ideology is, to my daughter, a rejection of her.
I can reject religious beliefs of people I love and it’s not a problem because I am not required to participate in the rituals of their belief systems, just respect their right to do so. But with my daughter I am required to participate or again, I am rejecting her personally.
It’s an ideology that can only exist if everyone participates. It is such a fragile thing that it must propped up and reinforced by everyone around the person professing it. Anyone who doesn’t want to participate or who questions it has to be pushed out or shut down. That is the only way to maintain it. There is no “agree to disagree” with this ideology. I end up feeling rejected by my daughter and she feels rejected by me. Both of us end up hurt. I am not angry with her. She is very angry with me.
in reading my own daughter's social media she created an unrecognisable account of our conversations which accords with the trans narrative. Even a letter she handed to us at the beginning was completely weird. She had never even written a postcard to us in the past, barely a birthday card unless under duress.
I find that all of the essays that I have read here on PITT are very well thought out and have excellent writing skills. I am somewhat amazed that in this day and age of lousy essays and postings on other public forums that the PITT folks always come through with topnotch informative writing!
There is one minor detail I would add to this post, would be: If one were to do a student's homework for them, they may get excellent grades on their "homework", but they would usually fail when they took a test.
I gave birth at 36; so if my eggs were stored at $300 per year time 32 years would cost $9,600, and that does NOT include inflation. Most people who work do not get free insurance. If you are self employed, private insurance is very expensive. Most people will be forced to pay closer to $4,000 annually.
I feel very sorry for you for "buying in" to the transgender ideology that REJECTS GOD. God has NOT rejected you and wants you to get healthy and follow Him.
all i gotta say is "pasta la vista"
Another bad idea: "This is not to say that we should cause pain. We should not. There is enough of it in the world without anyone ever having to purposely induce it."
Here we have a blindly reasoned demand for pacifism and passivism. This standard of ethics could easily be exploited by street savages and queergroomers to coerce acquiescence to any and every depredaton. Suppose, for instance, that some angry ghetto rat charges toward you while you're walking along a sidewalk. (Fyi, this is a real example.) Should you steadfastly refuse to spray the ghetto rat's face with an acidic solution just because there is "enough of it [pain]" in the world already.? You may think so if you're a twit, so then comes the pain of being attacked by the g.r., who has no doubt failed to experience adequate deterrence throughout its life. What do you suppose that your pacifism has just made more likely if the g.r. sees you again a week later?
Your pain could have easily been avoided by imposing the painful aversive stimulus upon the g.r.'s eyes and nasal cavity. So doing is likely to prevent you from experiencing pain in the short term. Again, in the short term, the total amt of pain may be about the same whichever option (spray or don't spray) you choose. Over the long term, spraying the worthless savage could reduce total pain because the g.r. will be more like to restrain itself. So here we ought to cause pain, or rather, to transfer expected pain from one being to another. (Just be mindful of an arms escalation, which is why I had a knife and warned the g.r. to run if it didn't want to bleed, too.)
Here is some more foolishness "The extreme excess of pain caused by man’s inhumanity to man must stop, and should be prevented whenever possible."
Pethaps the alleged extreme excess of pain is just what sissies, crybabies, and others deserve until they correct their bad attitudes and refain from bad action.
Ridiculous Assertion: "Further, while there is little to no value in physical pain"
On the contrary, physical pain is so important that a person who cannot feel it or who feels it very little, because of (say) some genetic defect or abuse of pain meds, would ruin its body with injuries. Most of us are conditioned during childhood to be wary of hazards like heights, sharpened edges, bugs with stingers, hot objects, rough pavement, and so on. Painful experiences with one or more of them motivates a bit of risk-reward thinking when confronted with these things. Sure, there's a risk of breaking an arm and scraping a few sq. inches of skin off our knees if we crash while biking. The benefits of riding the bike, however, can be obtained by proceeding with caution when learning how to ride. A child who cannot feel pain, however, will not have experienced falls and scrapes as aversive stimuli from which to learn the right lesson about prudence. This one is like a healthy child who systematically underestimates risks or overestimates benefits, and I think we all understand that this sort of child is likely to experience more injuries and a shorter life than average.
This makes perfect sense to me. I wish I could share it with parents I know who are going through all of this. It's pretty sad the bar is so low that my 82 yr old friend said I must be doing a great job as a mother. At least my daughter still wants to be a girl. sheesh.
The conversation with a disrupter yesterday on this subject brought up the question for me of whether to engage or not with insulting people in this space.
A few of us reading at the time confronted politely, which was to our credit, but whether it is a complete waste of effort is a question on my mind because of the disingenuous nature of those contributions.
With our own children we just hold the ground, but we don't know if 'Anonymous' was just a pure bad actor, a good chance of that.
What does anyone think any other approach to this situation should be?
PS I used to deep dive into Mermaids web chat posing as a 'gender questioning' child to see what kind of advice I got, to shocking results. I took screen shots of lots of it and shared with journalists. It is easy to pose as anyone you like online isn't it.
If one kid is reached by responding to trolling it is probably worth it. If the kids would catch on to the uniformity of trans positions and then use critical thinking to extract themselves it would be great. But we love kids who just think emotionally because they found a group that will pretend to love them. (Until they realize transition was an empty promise and desist)
I dream it might be my own daughter
You describe false kindness, false compassion, false mercy and false love. When kindness, love and compassion cannot be questioned or defined, when they are not held up to a template or a source for comparison, they can be perverted. Love is Love. Kind is Kind. Compassion is Compassion. Choose Kindness. "Kindness is Everything." (Really? That's nonsense!!! But its printed on yard signs in front of nearly every home in some Seattle neighborhoods) Before Kindness was everything; Religion, Culture and Tradition provided us with our templates and definitions. Without any guardrails or patterns to follow we can come up with perversion.
When I asked a gender clinician what the difference between the body dysmorphia experienced by someone with anorexia vs someone with gender dysphoria, she explained that they are very similar but gender dysphoria has a gendered flavor. So basically it’s the same body dysmorphia but for some reason they think the gender version has more validity and deserves affirmation. It is all based on the assumptions that sex is a spectrum, and it is separate from gender and gender identity. So made up nonsense.
It's part of why the TRA hate parents. The parents remember the before
You hit the nail on the head!
If you want to read a major source of this stuff- and the lies- it's here
https://genderdysphoria.fyi/en
All excellent and reasonable, but yes, you are missing something (not really)!
This is a cult and insane ideology. Period.
A very dangerous cult in that they are forcing everyone else to believe in lies! If you tell the simple truth that no man can be a woman.. what every child knows... you are vilified, canceled, fired from your job! Where else has something like that happened? North Korea, Stalinist Russia, Nazi Germany etc. ..
In 50 years people will write masters and PhD work on how this went from less than 1% of the population to over 5% in less than a decade. The biggest lie is that this is some natural reversion to the mean. It's not.
The first job of parents is safeguarding their children from outside harms. Unfortunately, now, parents are often the perpetrators of harm: https://lucyleader.substack.com/p/what-the-hell-is-wrong-with-parents And relationships alter brain development in mammals. Those comparing us to clownfish are forgetting that mammals aren't fish or reptiles: https://lucyleader.substack.com/p/are-you-a-mammal-or-a-reptile
I couldn’t agree with you more.
I’ve been trying to convince my 23 year old daughter of exactly what you’ve so eloquently expressed.
I may copy and paste this to her. Simply to point out there are others who share my opinion and feelings.
Thank you for your post.
I would bet that a vast majority shares your opinion, but most are afraid to say so! We have been mowed into submission of a very dangerous ideology!
Nothing much we give our children to read changes their minds, just be aware. They have been brainwashed by it for a long time without us knowing.
Absolutely spot on. Thank you for your compassion and clarity amid such a lot of cold confusion and carelessness. You could say the sex-change cultists practice a 'kind' to be cruel approach, the very opposite of what these young people and their parents desperately need, and all to feed the cruel money monster too.
"We have actually made it illegal to be nice to people suffering from gender dysphoria." To my mind this is the biggest problem. It's prevented all the counselors, therapists, psychologists and psychiatrists who could work to help resolve these issues from even considering helping these teens and young adults. There's just too much liability socially and professionally. It's a massive chilling effect.
Please be aware there is a malicious presence on this thread calling themselves 'anonymous.' I have reported but the posts might take time to be deleted.
I actually wish the comments were not deleted. I thought it was educational to see how trans-identifying people see this site and how TRAs interact with parents. How are we going to help our kids if we don't know what the influencers like "anonymous" tell them about us? Also, what he said about how cheap estrogen is... I had no idea and I think it is important to know.
If we allow disrupters freely onto this site then it is worth nothing to us. I am sure that others here can give links to reddit sites and others where the mindset is on display. I used to experience more argument like that on twitter till the 'other side' all signed up to 'terf blockers.' For me, this site is for reasoned conversation and expressing our sorrow in a constructive way.
I have doubts about the veracity of anything that poster said. I could feel the pain in the comments, but the comments could have been metaphorically lifted from the dysphoria bible. So much pain and anger. Any divergent thoughts from the current trans narrative means you're a neo-nazi who likes Catholic priests who rape children. Because really that's a huge number of people.
If I wanted to reread excerpts from "the dysphoria bible" I could just, you know read excerpts from it.
did I say something to offend you? I don't get your comment.
I'm referring to much of the content from the poster you're referencing.
right
I will say that one person has made me ponder something we see here. Many posters, and essay authors have described the child assuming a trans identity and disowning the parents. I'm now starting to wonder if that's sort of self-fulfilling prophecy of the parent rejecting the child (which is not what's described by our authors here) Where the kid, decides to preemptively strike in the disowning the trans influencers have convinced them is coming?
I've thought that myself. They groom and train the newcomers. You know they tell them that their families aren't going to accept them, they're transphobic, they'll disown you, etc. So they may just be doing the disowning first.
I think what the parent rejects is the gender identity. Or maybe I should just speak for myself, I don’t subscribe to the ideology, the idea that anyone is born in the wrong body. I don’t believe there is any part of a person called a gender identity that exists separate from their physical reality. I am not religious either. It’s really sort of a quasi religion IMO with gender identity replacing the idea of a soul. I don’t believe feelings are truths other than saying that it is true that you have feelings or a specific feeling. I don’t accept beliefs as facts. I believe I am a boy therefore I am a boy or I believe I am a girl therefor I am a girl. My rejection of the ideology is, to my daughter, a rejection of her.
I can reject religious beliefs of people I love and it’s not a problem because I am not required to participate in the rituals of their belief systems, just respect their right to do so. But with my daughter I am required to participate or again, I am rejecting her personally.
It’s an ideology that can only exist if everyone participates. It is such a fragile thing that it must propped up and reinforced by everyone around the person professing it. Anyone who doesn’t want to participate or who questions it has to be pushed out or shut down. That is the only way to maintain it. There is no “agree to disagree” with this ideology. I end up feeling rejected by my daughter and she feels rejected by me. Both of us end up hurt. I am not angry with her. She is very angry with me.
in reading my own daughter's social media she created an unrecognisable account of our conversations which accords with the trans narrative. Even a letter she handed to us at the beginning was completely weird. She had never even written a postcard to us in the past, barely a birthday card unless under duress.
I find that all of the essays that I have read here on PITT are very well thought out and have excellent writing skills. I am somewhat amazed that in this day and age of lousy essays and postings on other public forums that the PITT folks always come through with topnotch informative writing!
There is one minor detail I would add to this post, would be: If one were to do a student's homework for them, they may get excellent grades on their "homework", but they would usually fail when they took a test.
I gave birth at 36; so if my eggs were stored at $300 per year time 32 years would cost $9,600, and that does NOT include inflation. Most people who work do not get free insurance. If you are self employed, private insurance is very expensive. Most people will be forced to pay closer to $4,000 annually.
I feel very sorry for you for "buying in" to the transgender ideology that REJECTS GOD. God has NOT rejected you and wants you to get healthy and follow Him.