I appreciate that you're trying to appreciate individuation apart from individualism, but I don't think it works like that. I don't see they are separable. Instead, I believe that we are interdependent upon each other. Just as we are acorns relying on the water given to us by others, we are water for other acorns. For this reason, cuttin…
I appreciate that you're trying to appreciate individuation apart from individualism, but I don't think it works like that. I don't see they are separable. Instead, I believe that we are interdependent upon each other. Just as we are acorns relying on the water given to us by others, we are water for other acorns. For this reason, cutting people off is only allowable in situations of abuse; cutting people off always causes harm---it's just permissible when it causes less harm than continued exposure.
For myself, it is connection which is healing me from my childhood difficulties, specifically the connection I have with my spouse in marriage. I don't think this is individuation. What is real about individuation is found in healthy relationships and what they do for us, and the lifelong relationships we have are all familial.
I think the healthiest relationships are those between people who know and understand themselves, so are not projecting onto the other person. Also, there is something to me about a person having value in themselves; it doesn't make them less available to others, but I am worthy of existence regardless of who I love and who loves me. Does that make sense? Of course we need other people, I wouldn't deny that.
I don't think value can be defined into existence. It is either there or not. Now, I do hold to the intrinsic value of every human being---but this is by religious revelation which posits a divine relationship!
As far as knowing yourself or not, I find that this process is found out, again, in community. I learn my flaws from seeing the look on the faces of others around me, their reactions to my selfishness. I don't see this as a solipsistic walkabout. Part of the reason I'm pushing so back on this idea is because the original post pretty much explicitly valorized that kind of experience. What if his kid is just using hormones and surgery the way he is using mushrooms? Cut off the world, think only of yourself, "actualize" or "manifest" or just plain go self-absorbed.
Basically, I don't know that we disagree all that much, but I do see vast disagreement between myself and the original post.
Thank you, for this opportunity to formulate my thoughts. It seems to me that you're objecting to the original post using drugs. Drugs (whether botanical or synthesised) can be used for many different purposes: to shut down pain, in many cases, but also to courageously confront one's inner demons. I see the poster as using them in the latter sense. In this way he is dealing with his pain from the past and is able to let go of it; and thus is better able to be present for his beloved daughter. I see that as a very positive, unselfish action.
I appreciate that you're trying to appreciate individuation apart from individualism, but I don't think it works like that. I don't see they are separable. Instead, I believe that we are interdependent upon each other. Just as we are acorns relying on the water given to us by others, we are water for other acorns. For this reason, cutting people off is only allowable in situations of abuse; cutting people off always causes harm---it's just permissible when it causes less harm than continued exposure.
For myself, it is connection which is healing me from my childhood difficulties, specifically the connection I have with my spouse in marriage. I don't think this is individuation. What is real about individuation is found in healthy relationships and what they do for us, and the lifelong relationships we have are all familial.
I think the healthiest relationships are those between people who know and understand themselves, so are not projecting onto the other person. Also, there is something to me about a person having value in themselves; it doesn't make them less available to others, but I am worthy of existence regardless of who I love and who loves me. Does that make sense? Of course we need other people, I wouldn't deny that.
You are very gracious. Thank you.
I don't think value can be defined into existence. It is either there or not. Now, I do hold to the intrinsic value of every human being---but this is by religious revelation which posits a divine relationship!
As far as knowing yourself or not, I find that this process is found out, again, in community. I learn my flaws from seeing the look on the faces of others around me, their reactions to my selfishness. I don't see this as a solipsistic walkabout. Part of the reason I'm pushing so back on this idea is because the original post pretty much explicitly valorized that kind of experience. What if his kid is just using hormones and surgery the way he is using mushrooms? Cut off the world, think only of yourself, "actualize" or "manifest" or just plain go self-absorbed.
Basically, I don't know that we disagree all that much, but I do see vast disagreement between myself and the original post.
Thank you, for this opportunity to formulate my thoughts. It seems to me that you're objecting to the original post using drugs. Drugs (whether botanical or synthesised) can be used for many different purposes: to shut down pain, in many cases, but also to courageously confront one's inner demons. I see the poster as using them in the latter sense. In this way he is dealing with his pain from the past and is able to let go of it; and thus is better able to be present for his beloved daughter. I see that as a very positive, unselfish action.